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Eleanor M Owens's avatar

Fascinating video of Chas Freeman that I watched AFTER writing this article, which has even better informed my understanding of the Ukraine proxy war since I wrote it. Thanks to Pascal Lottaz @pascallottaz with Neutrality Studies for posting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaMKPSWLmRE

It's almost an hour long, but I encourage you to listen the whole way through. It's a horrible and complicated situation we're in, and it cannot be explained in a quick soundbite.

I do want to point out one thing I disagreed with, where he appears to criticize conspiracy theories in general as a blanket term (I think he was mostly criticizing echo chambers, but I just wanted to expand). As you may have seen from my writing, I've explored how the empire can also use its propaganda system to dismiss "theories" that actually have basis in reality. For instance, the empire has claimed that it's an antisemitic conspiracy theory to claim that Israel has any foreign influence over America. Yet somehow a large percentage of Congress receive AIPAC lobbying money, and the voices of pro-Palestinian are being silenced by the government.

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Nusper 1337's avatar

I had to watch 3-4 months of the most depraved snuff out of Gaza, to finally change my mind about the collective west.

Then I challenged myself on Ukraine and could only conclude that most of the so called "russian propaganda" was probably cold hard facts.

Of course I did a lot of research and listened to Mearsheimer etc. Things I would have dismissed as absolute idiocy of Russiophile weirdos.

After I had made my mind up, that not only was the west just as much or more to blame about Ukraine, as Russia...and that Ukraine has been bettayedby the west twice now... I stumbled upon this op-ed in the guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/13/ukraine-us-war-russia-john-pilger

Notice something in the comments, that try to discredit and blame the pro Russian Rebels for everything?

"The East of Ukraine is overrun with masked gunmen in camouflage toting machine guns who largely come from Russia. They are too gutless to remove their balaclavas and use women as human shields. "

I don't know why, but this hit like a truck. After listening to and reading Israeli/western pro genocide talking points again and again... always mentioning human shields...

I just lost my shit. I was in a pro peace, Ukraine is more complicated, this isn't helping Ukraine position up until that point.

Now it's different. Fuck the Ukrainian Nazi swines. Let them eat dirt.

I'm dobe with this shit. Putin did for his former soviet citicens, what no arab leader was willing to do for Palestinians.

Every 80-100 years the Nazis need a good beating from Russia, and we are at that point in history again

Srsly fuck ktaken, fuck s-14, fuck Asov and fuck the fascist degenerates in power, that speak of russian Untermenschen.

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